House Energy and Commerce Committee Chair Cathy McMorris Rodgers (R-WA) joined NBC News’s The Chuck ToddCast with host Chuck Todd. Chair Rodgers reflected on her time in Congress as well as her top priorities to rein in Big Tech, including Section 230 reform and the American Privacy Rights Act.

On Section 230 Reform:

“This is the moment. It's been an issue before Congress for years, ever since Section 230 was put into place in 1996 in the Telecommunications Act.

“The agreement for Big Tech—they weren't big at that time, because it was even before Google and Twitter and Facebook—was they were to moderate content, illegal, illicit in exchange for these liability protections.

“It's just very different. They have broken trust. They are not doing what they are [supposed] to be doing under Section 230.

“The courts have ruled in such a way that they have basically given them unlimited liability protections.

“I believe that this is a time when we—Congress—must act to protect individuals online, to protect our personal privacy rights online. The Energy and Commerce Committee has been working on this for decades, and we have a bill.

“We have the Section 230 bill, we have the American Privacy Rights Act that Senator Cantwell as the Chair of [Senate] Commerce has hammered out with me, and I believe that there is a sense among Members on both sides of the aisle that the American people know this needs to happen, and this is our moment.”

On Protecting Americans Data from Big Tech:

"Americans have no real understanding as to how much data is being collected.

“Right now, there is no limit. So, tech companies, other companies, businesses are collecting unlimited amounts of data.”

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“I think there's a growing concern among Americans that they are concerned about the amount of data, especially with AI, and this new world where there's going to be even larger data sets and computations. The individual is just going to get lost in that whole new world. That only increases the cry that we need to protect our identity online.

“We need to have individual privacy rights online, and I can tell you that this is an issue at home. When I talk about it, it's one that gets the heads nodding.”

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“[The American Privacy Rights Act] is protecting individuals, but especially our kids. Parents are very concerned about the amount of time that kids are spending online [...] The way that [the algorithms] are structured right now is to get your kids online, pull them in, and take them down destructive paths.”

On Tech Companies Avoiding Responsibility:

“That's where Section 230 comes into play, because they got the liability protections in exchange for this commitment that they would be moderating this content.

“Now we know that they have established algorithms that have become really about keeping us online for profit.

“There's this sense that they're putting their own profit ahead of what is best for us as a people, best for our children.

“We passed the TikTok bill earlier this year, and the President signed it into law, forcing the divestiture of TikTok.

“When we passed that bill, we weren't sure what the outcry was going to be, because people said, 'Oh, it's so popular...all these kids...177 million Americans', and yet there hasn't been this overwhelming outcry from the users.

“I think it is because, in our heart of hearts, a lot of people know that something needed to take place.”

On Protecting Americans from Applications Controlled by Foreign Adversaries, like TikTok:

“The bill targeted TikTok, but it also targets other apps that would be controlled by foreign adversaries.”

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“We defined [foreign adversary] as China, Russia, Iran, and North Korea.”

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“You remember the previous administration had attempted to force TikTok to divest because of the national security concerns, and the courts had ruled that they didn't have the authority to do that.

“So, there was a sense that Congress needed to act to clarify that there are laws on the books for foreign ownership, yet the CFIUS laws and the other laws were not covering these apps. They're relatively new.

“So, I believe that a targeted approach was important, but Members on both sides of the aisle were saying we need to address the [conduct of] technology companies that are headquartered in the United States of America.

“We need a privacy standard in the United States of America. We need to protect our kids online.

“There was this drumbeat that was certainly a part of that debate.” 

On Who Should Control Americans Data:

“Well, ultimately, you should have control over your data.”

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“The approach that I've taken in this proposal [the American Privacy Rights Act] is to put into law a privacy right. I know there's this debate around ownership and if they should have to pay the individual.

“We're putting into law a privacy right, so that a company, or any kind of a business entity that's collecting data, can collect only [data] for their business, for their service.

“You would have a right to know what that profile is.

“This is called data minimization.

“So, we minimize the amount of data that they can collect, and then anything beyond that, you would have to opt-in.”

On Minimizing the Data Companies can Collect on Individuals:

“We need a reset. We need to reset the internet to empower the individual.

“So now what this would do is reset where the individual will have a right to know what the profile is and make sure it's actually an accurate profile.

“Then, if your data is being sold, you're notified of that. So, it puts the burden on the business, the tech company, to actually notify you, and if you don't want your data to be sold, if you don't want it to be transferred, if you don't want them to know your location, then you can opt-out of that.

“Right now, it's notice and consent, and that is the way it currently operates.

“We're doing a reset to data minimization, and it puts the individual in charge of their data.”

On Stopping the Collection of Children’s Data:

“There's other laws that compliment this privacy law that you hear about: KOSA, the Kids Online Safety Act, COPPA, Children Online Privacy Protection Act, Section 230. I see them all as different pieces of what needs to happen to really do a reset to protect our identity online.”

On Protecting Small Businesses:

“Europe did pass a privacy law and I believe 80% of the world live in a country that has a privacy law in place. We don't.

“[Europe’s data privacy bill] was put into place and it's very bureaucratic, it's very regulatory and it has is raised costs, especially the small businesses and the startups.

“We want to make sure that [we support our small businesses].

“Part of Section 230 was to encourage liability protections for the small businesses and the startups, so that they can grow, and we have more competition.”

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"We include a right to cure for businesses that, you know, so they would have a right to get it right.

“If you're under 40 million, you're not included. If you're not selling data, you're not included in this.

"It's only if you're actually in the business of collecting data and selling it to another entity that you would be [subject to the provisions of the American Privacy Rights Act].

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CLICK HERE to learn more about the American Privacy Rights Act.